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Mitch Carson Transcript
S: Hello, and welcome to Marketing Speak! I’m your host, Stephan Spencer, and today we have Mitch Carson with us. Mitch is a bestselling author. His book, The Silent Salesmen, is published by J. Wiley. We met at Digital Hollywood. We were on a panel together, and I was just really impressed with his depth of knowledge and experience. Let me tell you a bit more about his experience: He has eight figures in infomercial sales; he pitched products on both Home Shopping Network and QVC; he produced and starred in infomercials; he had a syndicated radio show with CBS; he shared stages with such big names as Donald Trump, Zig Ziglar, Sir Richard Branson, Mark Victor Hansen, Jack Canfield, Dan Kennedy, Yanik Silver, Joe Polish, and Bob Proctor-it’s just a huge who’s who list of celebrity change makers and experts. He’s going to be talking with us about how to build up your celebrity, so welcome, Mitch! It’s great to have you on!
M: Thank you for having me here, Stephan. It’s always great to share with like-minded individuals who are looking to grow their brand and their presence online and offline.
S: Absolutely! Let’s talk about how to build up your celebrity status in your niche or industry.
M: Well, one of the things I wanted to share is-before we got the call started, I said I’m leaving after this interview to Dubai, and I have forty speakers who are burgeoning thought leaders in their respective niches going to attend my week-long event there. What I’m talking about today, I actually do and I put it to practice so all of what I’m going to share today is real because people have paid me a large sum of money to come and boost their brands to take it to the next level implementing a lot of the strategies we’re going to share here today. What worked for me what I found after being in business for many, many years-almost three decades of business in the marketing arena-what works and what doesn’t work, and it is a combination of factors. I mean, it’s massive action. A lot of little things in the old adage of, “Throw a lot of mud at the wall, see what sticks.” Well, I know what sticks with certainty. What I shared with you in the beginning is, I’m going to be performing a TED-like talk in both Dubai and in the country of Bahrain next week. I’m leaving in just a few hours as I shared, and the three things I’m covering there, and I’m going to give an expanded version of it on this call today is: Number one, the most critical of all is foundational. Finding the right message to the right market. Too many people, and I’m going to give you an example today. We were looking to get coverage in the Middle East for our speakers, and I was in conversation with Al-Jazeera network, which is a very large network in the Arabic world. Now, Dubai is a city and inside the United Arab Emirates, and I said, “I’m after the business market inside the city of Dubai, which is inside the country of United Arab Emirates, and I want to only focus on that market,” and they said, “Well, we cover all of the Gulf region,” meaning, they cover Bahrain, they cover Qatar, they cover Jordan, and they cover Saudi Arabia. All of that is outside of our target market. We were only interested in being exposed to a specific market at a specific time otherwise, it’s wasted media. I see this mistake, Stephan, often with people who go and buy media. They’ll buy national advertising-this is the same example-they’ll buy national advertising in the Wall Street Journal and they’re a local business. You’ve got to find your market and market to it-sell to it. Make yourself available to that market so they hear you. If you are marketing to right-handed golfers, and you’re a left-handed club manufacturer? Wrong market.
S: Yeah, you’re wasting a lot of money.
M: You’re wasting money. I mean, we’ve seen this countlessly. I mean, in the knowledge about is the area of SEO is: “Are you going to market?” If it’s only a weight-loss for diabetics, are you going to market to for weight-loss to people who have another issue? No. It’s very specific. Use a strong target, and if you know your target, use the best scope available. Arm your digital rifle and your offline rifle to go in and zero in on the right market.
M: Sharpen your saw ten times before you cut. That’s what the carpenter will tell you. You always get very clear what you’re going to do so when you do execute, you are on point. Find out what people are searching for in your marketplace. I mean, I’m going to vacillate between online and offline because some of the old rules still apply, but the new rules with online help us with the offline. And offline has taught us to be more specific and more accurate in our online efforts. Today, we have-I don’t know how many years keyword research has been in play. I mean, I’m curious-do you know that answer?
S: Since the 90’s, I think? No. Probably a minimum-like 2000 and 2001. I remember go-to had a tool for keyword research.
M: Exactly! So, it’s about 15-not even two decades old! Now, I’m going to go back-I used to own an advertising agency for many years and a direct mail house-meaning, we did mail-fulfillment for people. What gave the foundation for keyword research in many ways was, finding the right market when we sent out mail pieces, which was very expensive in some cases. You had to make sure that your list was accurate, that people lived where you were mailing or they were still at their place of business where you’re marketing to, and that was critical-it’s finding out the right message to the right market so you’ve got to find that if they’re available, they are searching, and they want what you have to offer. It’s incredibly important. Finding the right keywords will help you with your offline efforts today because we have all of these digital tools, what people are looking at in many cases over the last 30 days. The keyword research has become better, better, and better.
S: Yup. There is a lot of tools too that people are not aware of, that are just sitting under their nose, that are free and really gives you insight into different aspects of online behavior. For example, Google Trends.
S: There’s a feature in there to check on the popularity of keywords on YouTube-People behave differently on YouTube searching there versus on Google. Being able to differentiate the two with the free tool is amazing. Just go into Google Trends: www.google.com/trends. You choose, instead of “web search” from the pulldown, you choose “YouTube” search, and you put in your keywords and you see what people are searching for on YouTube.
M: Yeah. I mean, there’s a perfect example. If, for example, you are a professional speaker, which is part of the recipe for success that I’m going to go into in our interview today. If you are a speaker versus someone who isn’t visible and doesn’t speak, who only is a writer of content, a digital content provider without speaking, your keywords are going to be different as you just explained so if someone is searching for you to look at you as a speaker, they’re naturally going to see what your YouTube channel looks like, and see how you are in front of a camera. Whereas, if they’re looking to hire you as a writer, and you dispense content or provide content via the written word, they’re not going to look you up on YouTube. They’re going to look you up through the web search in most cases. YouTube would not apply. It gets much more granular and refined when you know the right message to the right market. If you are a speaker, and that’s one of the greatest tools I have been able to use in my career, if you have the ability to speak, are articulate, good on camera, aren’t shy, and can communicate your message well in front of a camera or in front of a live audience, YouTube is your friend.
S: Yeah. Well, one thing I’ve found recently is that being a speaker on stage and being a speaker in front of a camera, particularly a live TV audience, are two completely different worlds.
S: I’ve spoken on stages, literally, thousands of times over the last 20 years, and I’ve just started this TV career now of getting on TV news in different cities, and yesterday was my last most recent appearance. I was on Good Day Sacramento on CBS13.
S: Which is in the 20 largest markets, and so I was like, “Wow, this is amazing!” It was also terrifying because I’m so used to speaking on stages, I don’t have any nervousness about that, but getting on for TV and it’s a live TV audience-I can’t see any of them. I’m just talking to a host or a couple of hosts, and there are a handful of workers in the area, but you don’t have a TV audience-
M: There’s no feedback.
M: There’s no feedback.
S: It’s nerve-wracking!
M: Well, I have the same thing in reverse. I had a TV and radio background before I started on stages so I knew how to speak into air space, and it was harder for me to adjust to life stages later. Even though I was speaking to five million people selling products on Home Shopping Network, I got familiar with that platform. I got comfortable with that platform. When I, then, had to go live, it required a different level of training and engaging with real life people-people who are looking at me not laughing and engaging. It’s a completely different deal, platform, experience, training, and preparation.
M: They’re all different. Now, can you be good at all of them? Absolutely, but you must be prepared. The first time I was invited to a webinar to speak, I did horribly. I hadn’t been experienced. I didn’t know about it. I was back to speaking into air on the digital arena, but my slides had to be different than what they are on stage. You know, the use of video-I am a big user of video when I speak live because it supports my points and use testimonials to support what I’m talking about-they don’t work real well and go to webinar video because of the bandwidth issues of the registrants-the people in attendance-and it doesn’t play well so I had to purge that. You have to know your audience and, again, it goes back to right message, right market, and using and understanding the platform where you are communicating your message.
M: Those are three. I’m sure you’ve had some experience with webinars also. It’s a different media.
S: It is very different. It really is trial by fire.
M: Pretty much.
S: You have to prepare, you have to get training, and you’re still going to screw it up. You have to be okay with making mistakes, learning from the mistakes, and just iterating and getting better over time because as you switch platforms and as you switch the approach, there’s the learning period. I had to go through it and-
M: I had to go through it too.
M: It wasn’t easy. The first podcast you put together probably doesn’t even come close to what it resembles today.
S: True. Yeah.
M: You just get better with time. The first time you ride your bike without training wheels is an experience versus when you’ve been riding for a year. You get more comfortable, and you get better with practice so that covers my first point, Stephan. It’s finding the right message to the right market and understanding your platform so you are equipped and you’re armed correctly how to go in and conquer-how to go into battle. How are you going to conquer and win against the competition out there? There’s a misnomer out there. Well, I’m friendly with all my competitors and we all love each other-baloney! Baloney. It is business. Now, I’m not suggesting anything illegal, immoral, or unethical, but take it seriously. Be serious about your career, your craft, and your niche in your marketplace. You’re going to be equipped with a lot of weapons that we’re going to go through today, and it is a battle. That’s the best metaphor I’m going to use. You may disagree. I don’t believe in the friendly approach. You’ve got to be equipped to be nimble, quick, versatile, and willing to go and do what it takes to win. Maybe it’s because of my background of being in competitive sports. You can certainly be ethical and fair, but you have to be well-trained. You’ve got to be practiced, practiced, and practiced at whatever you’re doing. Knowledgeable. I mean, you didn’t write a book on SEO, Stephan, because you just fell into it. You learned it through the school of hard knocks.
S: Yeah, true.
M: Yeah. It’s important to understand your market, how to identify it, set your objectives, and then you’re ready to start executing. However, I think the groundwork is critical because otherwise, you’re going to fall. You will make some mistakes you can learn from, but let’s make sure that that path is not as slippery as it needs to be. It doesn’t have to be slippery. You can certainly learn as you go along, but have stable footing.
M: And that’s through identifying your market, good keyword research for both online and offline, and then the next step I would like to identify is, it’s critical to have a strong online presence. I mean, I could probably talk all day about this topic, but we are limited in time. The online presence depends on your niche or your marketplace, but I’m going to refer to being a thought leader or an expert in your field, and I think there are some critical components in order to be successful. A strict recipe for good eating. People are going to give you the thumbs up if you have the following. It starts with a well-built out either LinkedIn profile, which I think is important because people will check you out today, or you’ve got to have a strong Facebook. What I’m going to say about Facebook is, don’t be an idiot. Putting pictures up of you drinking, smoking, partying, and wearing less than all of your apparel inappropriately is a big mistake. You don’t do that. It’s online, it’s permanent, and the only thing that’s going to do is cost you business and potential embarrassment.
S: Well, some people say, “Well, I only do that with friends so not everybody is going to see that. It’s not public,” but it’s still a risk though.
M: Huge risk! You don’t put up risqué photos of yourself on your Facebook page. “Oh, I got it deleted!” You don’t if a friend’s going to accidentally post it. We’ve heard about all these YouTube videos of people filming their actions and then putting it up there anonymously-come on! Don’t do it in the first place, or destroy it or make sure that you’re the only one that has seen some of these photos. I don’t reckon to dictate what you do in your personal life, but when you post something online, you post it on G+, or you post in on Facebook-LinkedIn is a little more discriminatory-but you post in on Twitter, and you tweet about things-that’s permanent in the digital world. That’s a digital newspaper.
S: Yeah, even if you think you’re anonymous, and you’re posting it on Tumblr or something. Eventually the technology will exist to connect the dots and what’s known as “doxing”-you’ll get “doxed.” You’ll get outed on your Tumblr or wherever you think you’re anonymous or Reddit and you’re not or you won’t be.
M: Exactly! I’m a big fan of being ultra-careful, conservative, and smart when you post online. Your brand is all you’ve got, and it will come back and bite you in the butt. I mean, look what’s going on in our elections. When people hurl from things from 20-30 years ago. Let’s say 20 years ago from 9-11, what’s going on with Donald Trump as an example. Whether he said things or didn’t say things, he’s not the point, but my point is, be very careful what you post online. Your online presence is critical today because I have 40 speakers coming to Dubai, and we’re going to speak over in Bahrain. The Bahraini government did background checks on all the speakers before they would endorse the event. One of our speakers has some risqué photos on her Facebook-I’ll leave her nameless because it’s not important-they denied endorsing our event because of her. Having a less than flattering photos with alcohol and a cigarette in her hand while showing big cleavage.
M: That cost a government endorsement, hence, money for us paying for the meals of people than if she had been more conservative. Many of the people who are hoping to go and speak over there as paid consultants to the Bahraini government, she blew our chance right there. Here’s a current-I mean, as in, we found out today-current event: Be ultra-careful what you post online. Be very careful.
M: And clean up your Facebook. If you’ve got pictures from two-three years ago that aren’t very flattering, get it off.
S: Of course, it may already be too late.
M: Maybe or maybe it isn’t. You know what I mean? Some people aren’t as astute as you to find information or maybe some others, but if you can remove it so that nobody can see it, you just don’t post things that are going to cost you. An online presence have strong LinkedIn, manage your Facebook, manage your Instagram account if you use that, if you have a Tumblr blog, if you have your own personal WordPress blog-all of these can grow with your brand and showcasing your best self. And I’m a big fan of correct spelling. Some people say, “Well, it’s my blog, and so what if I have spelling errors?” Again, people will judge you based on what they see. An occasional error here and there, fine. I’m a fan of spelling correctly in your native language and capitalizing the beginning of a sentence. This may sound minute, but people have lost potential jobs because they didn’t use correct grammar and punctuation. Does this make sense, Stephan?
S: Absolutely! In fact, I’ve used these kind of criteria myself when I’ve looked at hiring people either as contractors or employees. If they make a spelling or grammatical error in their cover letter or on their resume or something-they’re gone.
M: Unacceptable! I agree. If you didn’t take the time to capitalize or put a period or put your punctuation inside the quote-
M: And these are obvious-we learned this in high school. If you’re hiring a mechanic, maybe not so important, but if you’re hiring a writer or someone that’s going to be handling communication for your business, and they make those mistakes? They’re careless, and you’ve just opened the beginning of problems.
M: Exactly! Just to clean it up. I think it reflects very important. For you to be a thought leader or an expert, you’re held to a higher standard. You are held to a higher standard. If you, in fact, want to be an Indian, that’s fine. If you want to be a chief, act like a chief.
S: Yeah, so you get LinkedIn, Facebook, and Instagram-where else do we need to build that strong online presence?
M: Well, I would also say, have a blog. A personal site like I have a site called MitchCarson.com. Most people who are, let’s say, thought leaders-I don’t like the term guru so much, but let’s just say thought leaders or niche experts have their own branded website or WordPress blogs-somewhere where there’s content about you. I think if it’s StephanSpencer.com, as an example, or something close to that where they’re looking you up-you are found. In my case, as Mitch Carson, I’m competing not with Yahoo and Bing for some reason, but with Google, I’m competing with Mitchell Carson, the fictional character in a comic book story.
S: I saw that!
M: Yeah! The Marvel-I’m competing against this villain.
S: Yeah, in Ant Man or something, right?
M: Exactly, and it’s hard for me to be-I mean, my LinkedIn profile outranks, but I come up on the full page on Yahoo and Bing, but when it comes to Google, I’m flanked. In YouTube, no problem. They find me, but for some reason Google ranks that higher because they have a Wikipedia page. Now, if you’re so lucky and you have all the elements to have your own, Wikipedia page-oh my gosh, is that powerful! I know you’re aware of that. For SEO purposes, there’s a lot of credibility to having your own Wikipedia page.
M: And I know they have their loose criteria of being notable as well as being published. I don’t know how to define that-when they say notable.
M: What does that mean really?
S: Well, it’s tricky. I know a fair amount about what Wikipedia. The notability guidelines are-
M: Vague, aren’t they?
S: They are vague, but the idea is easy to grasp. I mean, either you’re encyclopedic or you’re not. If you’re worthy of being in an encyclopedia then prove it, but if you are not, then you’re trying to, basically, swim upstream and you’re doing something that is not what the Wikipedia editors want to see happening. It happens all the time, and they’re deleting-it’s called AFD or articles for deletion. They’re AFD-ing articles all over the place where it’s just self-promotion, they’re non-notable people or companies, and they’re just trying to get another slot in the Google search results using a high authority site like Wikipedia.org.
M: Exactly! I mean, if you are encyclopedic-I like that term. I don’t think I’ve heard that before, but that is a great term. I’m going to write that one down. Encyclopedic. Yes, that is very good, Stephan! The viewers who are encyclopedic, can get inside Wikipedia, and have a page describing who you are-awesome! The other-and you’re a big fan of this because I know you invested in it yourself and saw that media payoff-if you are newsworthy and can get inside the press-that means, let’s start, couple levels-in the written press, getting your articles published inside Entrepreneur Press, Huffington Post, The Wall Street Journal, or TechCrunch-I mean, all of those very high-authority websites, magazines, or newspapers is awesome. The other element is, again, if you are a speaker and aren’t afraid of being in front of a camera, like you have just experienced, to get in the news. I’m a big fan of that. In fact, I’m producing that for my speakers in Dubai. They’re guaranteed television exposure. If someone is to look you up, let’s just say simply-if you are a chiropractor, just a chiropractor, you’re Bill the Chiropractor, and your patients or potential patients look at your website, which is the way they do it today, and I’m going to tell you how to do it in your office for offline-if they come in, and they look you up as Dr. Bill, the chiropractor, and they look at Dr. Bob, the chiropractor who has no press, has never been written up in any magazines or newspapers, and has never been on television, who do you think they’re going to go to? Bob or Bill? Bob who has written in the local paper. He’s also writing. He has been exposed in Forbes for whatever reason or in the health magazine and the related niche, and he has been on television, in the local markets-plural-in several local markets and, potentially, an international market, who is going to get the patient and who’s going to be able to charge more for the same service?
S: Yeah. It’s a no-brainer. It opens doors immediately. I was able, after a TV appearance in Albuquerque, to get a meeting with a prospect. It’s the first time I’ve ever been in Albuquerque. It was for two TV appearances that week, and lo and behold, I’m talking to a prospect a week before. I’m like, “Oh, you’re in Albuquerque. I’m actually going to be on TV.” I mean, that put me in a whole different ballpark with them to say, “I’m going to be on TV on two of your local stations next week, and let’s find time to get together for a meeting or a lunch,” and the same thing happened yesterday in Sacramento. I had a meeting after my TV appearance with somebody who I’ve just been on the phone with in the previous week. I mean, “I’m going to be in Sacramento for, again, for the first time in my life, and it just so happens to be next week.” These things can have an immediate payout or an immediate benefit even, as you said, just the credibility of having logos on your website and the clips so that people can watch them and say, “Oh, well Dr. Bob, I mean, I’m going to use him because clearly-“
M: He’s an expert!
S: Yeah! He’s been on The Doctors or whatever that show is.
M: The perception of expertise is inarguable.
M: It is inarguable. It’s irrefutable proof that you are an expert. Whether you are or aren’t, if you know how to crack backs the same as Bob or Bill, but you’ve been on TV, you’re going to get paid more, nobody’s going to dicker about your price because they get to-Peggy comes in to get her back cracked from Bob, and she goes and tells Penelope, “I just went inside Dr. Bob. He cracked my back, and he’s the best in the world because he was on TV. He’s an expert. He was on Fox. Did you know that he was in Sacramento also? He cracked backs on The Governator!” I mean, or whatever they can say!
S: That’s awesome!
M: You get the idea, and then it creates veracity that you’re not even aware of because guess what? She tells Penelope. Penelope is going to want to see Bob. They don’t care about the money because she gets to tell her husband when he gets home from work, “I just got cracked by an expert. He was on TV. He’s the best. Honey, your back’s hurting, you’ve got to go see him!” That goes three deep.
S: Yeah, and TV is a whole other animal and more powerful-way more powerful-than radio, which is also more powerful than the written press.
M: Exactly! You have all three of them, and you’ve tapped into something super important, Stephan-you’ve got to have all three. I’ve got radio, I’ve got print, and I’ve got TV. Why? Because it gave me the elevation. Am I any smarter than somebody else? Possibly. Possibly. Who went to the same college, has the same level of intelligence, but I get to charge more because of the perception of me being an expert, and this will bring me into the other element that I think is an important and critical online component, and it all gets interwoven is, if you truly want to be perceived as an expert in your niche, you’re category, and your business, you must have a book. You have heard this before so I can’t be the first one to mention it. Get off your bum, and get a book written. There are all sorts of ways to do that. That topic itself is worthy of its own podcast, and if you want to invite me back in a future date, I could walk through the steps because I’m not only self-published, I’m published with John Wiley and Sons, the biggest business book publisher in the world-they have two. I was published in English and in German with my book, and it’s a process, a necessary one. Now, the two things that have made the biggest paradigm shift in my income, because that’s the measuring stick we go by like it or not-income. People can say, “Well, I’m deeper than that. I’m spiritual.” Okay, fine. How much money are you making? You can be spiritual all day long, but how much money are you making? Are you able to feed your family? Are you feeding yourself? Are you living well or are you worried about where your next nickel is coming from? The two biggest shifts-I’m talking not making 10% more, I’m talking 400x more money was when I became a published author, and I prove that I was on television. Those two right there made all the difference in the world. I went for making just over six figures to making over seven figures plus per year.
M: Those two are the trackable elements that made the difference in perception because here’s what happened, was I any smarter because I wrote a book? Nope. A little more seasoned and savvy because of the process, and because I was on television, was I any smarter? Nope. A little more seasoned and savvy because I knew the process of what it took to get there, and then I can prove it, but all the sudden, because of that, having been on television, having a published book, here’s what happened, and this is the one that ratcheted my income through the seven-figure mark. I’m talking personal income. I’m not referring to gross sales. I’m talking personal income, which is a big distinction.
M: Net. What did it? Because I had a book that was written and published. I’m not talking a Kindle book. It doesn’t count, sorry. That’s a junior college versus Harvard. Big difference. Real university of life versus go into the local junior college. Sorry, it’s not the same. What it did for me was, it got me on speaking stages, which is my other big element that I’d like to cover or, maybe, close out with. What it did for me when I became a speaker domestically, and then I started speaking internationally? Oh my word! My world opened up, and it also commensurately changed my income. Income. Money. Profits. Freedom. Love of self. Others looked at me in a different manner. All the sudden, I became respectable. Who doesn’t make six figures? Okay. Some don’t. All right, who doesn’t make five figures? Whatever your income level is, but if you want to get a big income quickly? Number one, you’ve got to be open-minded and willing to make some changes, but get yourself in the position to start speaking, and to speak at a high level on the highest stages in the world, you must have television, you must have radio, you must have print, and you must have a book. Otherwise, you’re going to run into some blocks.
M: That’s my humble opinion, but it isn’t so humble, it’s a reality.
S: You made an important distinction between self-publishing and getting a real publisher-
M: New York publisher like Time Warner, Penguin, and Entrepreneur Press. Books that are, then, distributed, and they can find you in the public bookstores, and they can find you in airport bookstores. I’ve sold 9,000 copies of my book in airport bookstores. I got deals because I was in the airports. I wish I had kept it there. You pay for the media, you pay for the space, the real estate, but oh my God, there’s a huge difference. They do not accept self-published media in Hudson Booksellers. You must be published with a real New York publisher with distribution. Hence, credibility. Everything is perception. Your self-published book could be the great work that would push Tennessee Williams to the side. I don’t care. If it’s not published with a New York publisher, it is not the same. It’s a difference between the Junior College and Harvard. We all, as kids, if you were in the academic mindset, aspired to go to MIT or Harvard or Yale. Some of us had restrictions not the other. I’m not a Harvard graduate. I went to USC-University of Southern California. I wish I had. My brand would have been different. It’s because colleges, where you go, is reflective of your brand. Where you get published is reflective of your brand. Being on TV like you’re doing is one of the smartest moves you’re ever going to make, Stephan, in my opinion. You took the opportunity. You’re executing because your perception of the marketplace will be shifted forever. It’s permanently changed.
M: You’ve been on TV now. You’re already a published author. You understand the gig. I mean, can you ascertain a figure what that’s done for your credibility reflected in either getting hired as a consultant or speaking because of you being a published author?
S: Oh, seven figures easily.
M: Yeah, you see! Case in point. That in itself could be a whole podcast or two-understanding the self-published arena versus the published arena.
S: Yeah, and I would definitely have you back to talk about this because this is a really important topic, and there are a lot of distinctions just within that world of getting your book published. Like you mentioned, Hudson Booksellers. Most people don’t realize that you pay to play to be in their airport stores.
S: And it can definitely payoff. There’s a positive ROI there if you do it right.
M: Big time! And it paid off for me.
S: And you can engineer your way on to the New York Times bestseller list even.
M: Yeah. It’s called “writing a check for $350,000.” That’s what it is! I mean, that’s what it costs today to ensure that success, but what does that give you is an irrefutable badge at a higher, higher, higher level.
M: I mean, we both have friends who are New York Times bestsellers. They went to Harvard in the publishing arena.
M: I make a lot of references to Harvard, but it’s the brand that most of us can relate to. If you go to Harvard, you have a different badge than someone who went to a state college.
M: And if you are a New York Times bestseller versus an Amazon bestseller-give me a break.
S: Yeah. In some obscure category in Amazon like, “Whoo! I was a-“ for six hours!
M: Yeah, I know. “I was a number one in my category,” Oh, good. You were the only one in your category. Awesome!
S: Yeah, right! But it is a hard road. It’s kind of like a fire walk every time I go on camera, and I’m on set. The butterflies are going, and I’m just really nervous even though I don’t show it.
S: I’ll get past that.
M: With practice, my friend. It gets easier, but after all the television I did, the initial component before I went live, I always had the butterflies.
M: Even today. I’m going to be doing television next week in Dubai and in Bahrain. Multiple times, I’ll be interviewed. I’ll probably have that initial element of nervousness. When I started my show on Saturday afternoons on CBS Radio Los Angeles, before the engineer counted down, and I had that initial butterfly. It was excitement. It’s natural. I’ve been on countless TV stations and radio stations. I always have that. It’s good. That’s a positive caffeine.
S: Yeah, and I like how you talk about these three different areas: print, TV, and radio, all working together. So it’s like the trifecta, and-
S: If you also distinguish that there are two types of print where you can have a column or an article that you wrote published somewhere prestigious like the Wall Street Journal or New York Times or whatever or more likely, something like Forbes or Entrepreneur.com, and you could also get people writing about you-journalists writing about you, and you’re kind of the main focus of the story.
S: That’ way better?
M: Of course.
M: Of course. You are the featured piece, and there is a credible credibility. I produce events, for example, in Bangkok. Four events a year-business events. I’m a consultant to the promoters over there. I bring in the American speakers. They wanted a particular speaker. I gave them a list of people that I knew could fill certain slots, and the promoters asked for one person because he had written an article in Forbes. He won out over all the other candidates because they had a perception, “Oh my gosh! He must be an expert. He’s been in Forbes!” Now, the guy had never been on TV. He was an up-and-coming marketer in his category. I’ll leave him nameless, but he had been in Forbes. They assigned huge credibility to him being written up in Forbes. He wrote an article on a particular topic- a 700-word article. They selected him against some names that were huge, and this is an up-and-coming marketer.
S: Yeah, that’s amazing. It is, again, another opportunity where you can, essentially, pay to play or you can just have good introductions to the right people at Forbes, and work your way up to the top.
S: Just like with of the New York Times bestseller list. You can either pay to play or you can do the hard yard-get on TV. Good Morning America or The Today Show could put you in the New York Times bestseller list because of your amazing performance on TV because you work your way up or you just pay the $350,000 or whatever.
M: Yeah, but here’s the other piece: If you have been on the radio, the challenge for people is, how do they get started? Because if you want to start by writing a column, they’re going to ask you to show writing samples.
M: If you want to get on a radio station, where are your radio samples? I mean, that, in my opinion, is the easiest because you can start at a local AM station to get on a particular topic. Know your topic. I would suggest that the easiest is to get on the radio because that venue is slowly declining, yet still has credibility and teeth. Once you have been on the radio, you can use that as leverage. Say, “Hey, I was interviewed…” The perception goes up. You can use that to get on other podcasts. You can use that to place content on blogs. You know what I mean? Again, there are so many different subsets of where you can do guest blogging, you can also be on podcasts. I’ve been on your podcast now. If I wanted to market myself to other big podcasters, I can say that I was on Stephan Spencer’s podcast.
M: That would open up, “Oh, here’s my interview!” All of sudden, I’ve got the credibility. I’ve been interviewed already. It only takes one to start. You caught my interest when you suggested that we get together and chat about being on your podcast because you use names of other people who’ve been on here. It caught my attention. This is how it works in the marketing arena. It’s a lot of smoke and mirrors with verifiable proof.
S: Well, it’s like dominoes where the first domino falls, and then the rest fall in line.
S: I remember this strategy working so well so many years ago when I was in the early days of my online marketing career. I’ve secured Seth Godin-
M: Oh, wow!
S: He donated an hour-and-a-half of his time to be on a teleconference. It was amazing. The way it worked is I got that first domino, which happened to be-well, through my friend, Toby Bloomberg, who had a really great relationship with Robert Scoble so I invited her to be on this teleconference, and she said she could get Robert Scoble, who is a good friend of hers, and she did. Once I had Robert, I was able to reach out to Seth and say, “Hey, I’ve got Robert Scoble on this. We’re going to be talking about business blogging and so forth, and we’d love to have you on too.” He said, “I’m in. Any opportunity to chat with Robert, I’m in.” Now, I had Seth and Robert. It was easy to get people like Steve Rubell, Doc Searls, and so forth to say, “Oh yeah, totally, I’m in!”
M: Just like you said, you’ve got to get that initial door open. I mean, one of the people I didn’t put on my list, and I’m going to amend my bio, was J. Conrad Levinson.
M: Yeah, he’s passed now, but the creator of the guerrilla marketing series. I don’t know how many books are to his credit, but he’s been published all over the world. I was able to interview him 20 years ago, and because I was able to use his name as someone I interviewed, I got Joe Vitale, and because I got in, I used Dan Kennedy, who was my first, as I was in his mastermind years ago. He opened the door to Joe Vitale. Because they, all of a sudden, “Oh, you’ve caught my attention! If you’ve interviewed this person then-“ my competitiveness or their competitiveness kicked in, “Well, I want to be interviewed. I’m just as good as Joe Vitale.” Then, I got into Jay Abraham. “Dan’s there-I’ve got to be there!” Then, Bill Glazer wanted to be there. You see, it works in tandem. Like you said, you have Robert Scoble, and that opened up Seth Godin.
M: Then, “Oh, who’s Stephan Spencer?” “Oh, he’s been on Fox News. He’s been in the Sacramento market. He’s done this. He’s written a book.“ “Oh, he’s legitimate.” Immediately, the judgment is made. People say they don’t judge-BS! We all judge. That’s how it is. Whether you like it or not, I don’t care what the Bible says or any other religious text book, it is reality-we do judge. It’s a human nature.
S: Yeah, and the way I see it, these are all stepping stones on to Good Morning America or The Today Show for me. I want that New York Times bestselling book I’m working on it. It’s going to come out next year. I’m going to get an incredible publisher. I’m working on that too. I’m going to be on The Today Show or Good Morning America or both with that book.
M: Yeah. That’s how you do it.
M: That’s how you do it. I mean, you’ve got to have a plan and execute. To be on New York Times bestseller without $350,000 of disposable money, you’ve got to plan your strategy correctly.
M: And it can be done. You just have to be thorough and tick all the boxes.
S: And have that pig-headed determination.
S: Like Chet Holmes has talked about. His book, I think, is called The Ultimate Sales Machine.
M: Yeah, it was a really good book. I knew Chet as well. He’s another one I forgot that I shared a stage with twice-
M: Hell of a marketer and salesman.
S: Yup, who’s now passed. As far as getting on to radio or podcasts, do you have any tips to kind of grease the wheels and to get things started? For example, I’ll share one. To get on to podcasts, there’s a service called Interview Connections, and you can pay as little as, I think, it’s under $100 to get their silver membership. It’s a one-time fee, and you’re in their database to get interviewed by their clients who are podcasters, and so I’ve been on Built to Sell, for example, and it’s a pretty popular podcast, and that was through the silver membership in Interview Connections.
M: Oh, that’s great!
S: Yes, so that’s an easy one. There’s also Born to Influence. Esther Kiss is the podcaster there. She works with people to get them booked onto podcasts, and you can get a package with her for four podcasts a month. Actually, she can do the same thing with Interview Connections too.
M: What is the charge? What does she charge?
S: It’s thousands a month. I don’t recall the exact price.
M: Oh, it’s expensive. It’s a big investment.
S: Yeah. Interview Connections is less. I think that’s in the hundreds per month.
S: And you do two, four, eight podcasts per month or something like that. This from memory, but-
M: Yeah, but this is a great way to start, and the other way-I wasn’t aware of these, Stephan, because, frankly, at this point in my career, I’m at a different level-
M: But, if I were to start, those are great services. The other is to do a search on podcast directories to find the ones that are message-to-market match. Listen to these people, send them a private message saying, “I just love your recent podcast, Bill.” I like the name Bill. “I like your podcast, Bill, and the expert you just had was excellent,” and you start off a relationship. You engage with this person at first. “If you ever find the need to have a content provider of XYZ service, I’d love to be considered.” It takes something that simple.
M: That simple! Do this every day. One person per day for a week. Somebody is going to-because one of the biggest challenges as a show is finding the right content and finding people who are able to fill the spot. It’s prestigious to be on a show, but they have to have people that are out there combing to find the right expert to fill in the episode.
M: So, you might be considered.
S: And that’s how I got on the Year of Purpose podcast. I was just sending out an email to the host, Zephan Blaxberg. I just said, “Hey, here’s my story. Maybe you want to have me on. I’m a fellow podcaster.” That’s another thing too. If you’re, let’s say you’re trying to get the attention of a blogger, and you’re a blogger as well, that gives you a lot more relatability. If you’re a podcaster, and you’re reaching out to another podcaster asking to be on their show, that’s a lot more relatable and there’s an easier rapport building there than if you’re just-worst case scenario-a PR person on behalf of a client reaching out. I hate those.
M: Well, exactly! You have the nomenclature and the lingo to communicate with that person.
M: And the resources you gave her are tremendous. I mean, it’s amazing what’s available today. To be able to find the right person for the right message-again, that goes back to right message, right market.
S: Yup. Oh, one more resource I’ll mention, and this is specific to radio: I heard Alex Carroll speak at Author 101 University, and his site is RadioPublicity.com. He has a list of radio stations. He has some training on how to get on to radio. He’s been on radio lots and lots of times. That’s another resource, but you have resources too because you’re training people how to get on the radio, how to get into print, how to get on to TV, and how to get on stages so, what’s your program?
M: I have a seven-day crash course, which is really what it is. I bring people to foreign markets. I did this in the Bahamas. I’m doing this in Dubai next week. Dubai and Bahrain. Where we give them radio interviews, we provide them television, we provide them stages with a multi-camera shoot, and we provide them a sizzle reel to showcase their talents. All of this is written media so they are in a newspaper or a magazine. All of the elements are there so they are changed in seven days. It is a fast track method to celebrity status. That’s my service. It’s a little different. It’s overseas. I don’t provide this domestically yet. I may at some point in the future, but I have focused on the other markets. We’re doing another program in December where we’re bringing people to London and getting them all of that in the UK so they have a different experience. The hardest part for a speaker is to get his or her first stage. Finding your first podcast. Finding your first television show. We’re giving these potential thought leaders all of it guaranteed. That’s my distinction in the marketplace.
S: And what’s the name of this program?
S: Great! MitchCarson.com-that’s your personal brand website.
S: I presume you’re available for speaking for keynotes and so forth?
S: So, if somebody wants to hire you to speak at their conference, they can contact you also through MitchCarson.com?
S: Back to this idea of having a personal brand website versus your company website, and building up both. In fact, I have a handful of different websites. I have StephanSpencer.com, which has my speaking; my TV appearances; my radio, print, podcast appearances, and all that; lots of resources; and useful trainings and things like that for people. I also have MarketingSpeak.com for the podcast that we’re doing right now. I have a different podcast, a separate one called The Optimized Geek, and that has a website OptimizedGeek.com, a separate brand, and all that. And then, my book. I have multiple books, actually, and each have separate websites so The Art of SEO, which is the one I’m most famous for. I co-authored. That has a website ArtofSEOBook.com. Social eCommerce is another one of my books. It’s SocialECommerceBook.com. Then, Google Power Search, and that is PowerSearchBook.com so-
M: You’re on top of it. I mean, you’re doing what you’re supposed to be doing.
S: Yeah, but for a lot of people, they don’t see the value of putting out all these different websites. Well, from an SEO perspective, shouldn’t I consolidate all my authority in one site?
S: And this is a separate discussion than just SEO-
S: This is about establishing yourself as an authority in the eyes of your prospect, and having those logos like ABC, CBS, NBC, and all that changes the game. That’s not an SEO issue. Yeah, you get some extra page rank flung to your site from a link from a news station or something, but that’s not the reason you do it. You do it for the brand positioning with major TV networks. Just like you have a separate site for your book because your book deserves it.
S: Your book is kind of a big deal, and it deserves to have a companion website to go with it.
M: You’re absolutely right, and I’m going to make full disclosure here in transparency. I didn’t create a full book website for my book. I should have, and now, you’ve inspired me to do so. Check back with me in a month, and it will be done.
S: All right, awesome!
M: But I learned-I mean, you’re a wealth of knowledge, Stephan. I mean, we should Mastermind together on some strategies because you know a lot of information, and that’s how you learn. It’s engaging with like-minded individuals who want to enhance and grow.
S: Absolutely! I’m a big fan of Masterminding, also establishing a mentorship. Finding a mentor, being a mentor. I’m a big fan of that. There’s a whole chapter dedicated in the Think and Grow Rich book to the power of Masterminds, and what they can do for you. I, definitely, am a big proponent of Masterminds. My life changed dramatically-
M: Same here.
S: When I went, for example, on the Tony Robbins Mastermind called, Platinum Partnership. It’s just amazing! You’ve been in a bunch of Masterminds, I believe, as well.
S: What will be some of your favorites?
M: Well, I was in Dan Kennedy’s for nine years. His private Mastermind. There were about 14 of us and it was high level. High achievers. Big achievers. This is when he was involved directly. He doesn’t handle the Mastermind components like he used to. I mean, this was many years ago, but it was one of the key elements of my growth because there, in the Masterminds, was where I learned about authorship. I learned about speaking, and I learned about collaboration with like-minded people. Non-competitive alliances. Helping one another. It opened up doors for me to speak, and speaking, as I shared earlier, was the cause of the big shift in my income and in my life.
S: Yup, and also having those TV appearances, not just so that you can be on TV at that moment, but so that you can leverage that in your marketing, you mentioned sizzle reel as part of the deliverables that you get with your program. Let’s elaborate just a little bit on the power of a sizzle reel because you can have that on your website, you can have that on your You Tube channel, you can have that in your offices-let’s say you’re Bob the Chiropractor. You want to have that on a continuous loop.
S: Or your TV appearances like the-
M: In the waiting room.
M: In the lobby. It shows who you are-you’re already sold-so when someone comes in, Bob the Chiropractor, who’s charging $40 a cracking, which is the going rate, he can charge $60 because Peggy is not going to argue with him because he’s a celebrity. It sells before you’re being sold. They’ve already bought you.
M: That’s the difference.
S: Yeah, and it works.
M: It works extremely well. Who’s going to argue with the guy that’s been on TV? All right, I’ve got a waiting list of people that want to see me. You can go to Bill. Bill’s not on TV. Bill’s not a published author. Bill hasn’t been on the radio. Bill hasn’t been written up in any of the newspapers. Go to Bill, and you’re going to get mediocre cracking.
S: I said this to you earlier before we started taping this, you could easily be a comedian and make a really good living.
M: Thank you very much. Thank you, thank you!
S: We’re about out of time here.
M: Yes, sir!
S: Last thing is, if somebody wanted to work with you individually, is that possible? Could they hire you as their private coach? Do you offer your services on an individual basis?
M: Individual basis, I have two private clients right now. They signed up for a year mentorship where I walk them through this whole process that I’ve addressed in our podcast today, and I guarantee them stages. I am open to limited consulting. I don’t have room for that level of person at this point, but I do have programs that is all custom. Custom for the person, depending on what they want. My market is thought leaders and speakers who want to take their business to the next level or people who want to grow their niche. I am able to work with a limited group of people. They can come to my events that I put on like the one, Speak in Dubai.
S: Yes, so I’m going to put links to your different offerings in the show notes.
S: Listeners, check back on the Marketing Speak website for the show notes with the links, and also grab the transcript while you’re there. We’ll create a checklist of actions to take based on the interview here, download all that, and start working through some of these action items. Take massive action as Mitch says. Any last parting words you want to share, Mitch?
M: Yeah, take action. You just said it. It’s like, do something. The world keeps “world-ing.” If you don’t do something, you’re going to be exactly where you were yesterday today if you do the same thing.
M: It takes the first step. Take little steps moving forward. Take the first step. Put your toe in the water, and it starts with a first action. You have to get on the bike to learn how to ride it. Use some training wheels, that’s fine, until you get some forward motion. You’ll eventually get there. It just takes little steps.
M: It’s not scary when you have a clear road map.
S: That’s true. The journey of a thousand miles begins with the first step.
S: Yup. All right, Mitch, thank you so much for sharing your brilliance. Listeners, I will catch you on the next episode. This is Stephan Spencer, signing off.